Hot Takes, Grievances, & Icks!

"It's Festivus for the rest of us!"

In this episode of BYOB, hosts Kelly and Nikki dive into their bookish and cinematic grievances, sharing hot takes on movies, authors, and adaptations. They explore their biases against certain storytelling formats, critique popular authors like Sally Rooney, and express disappointment in adaptations like Rings of Power. The conversation is filled with humor, relatable rants, and a deep love for storytelling. 

Listeners can now send BYOB fan mail! Click the link at the bottom of the show notes to send Nikki and Kelly a message.

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Transcript

Kelly (00:11)

Hey everybody, welcome to BYOB, the Bring Your Own Book podcast. I'm Kelly. And today we have something a little bit different for you. We are going to talk today about some of our bookish and movie and TV... so like overall story, let's say preconceived notions or biases that we just can't help but have, okay?

Nikki (00:16)

and I'm Nikki.

Kelly (00:40)

So I'm talking maybe some of these will be hot takes. I don't know. I'm sure we will have some hot takes between the two of us. But I just feel like Nikki and I have so many complaints about things that we need to air some of these grievances. Like this is our festivus. Okay.

Nikki (00:47)

Yep.

Yeah, we are really good at complaining and ranting. And but we were talking about before we started recording that we had a hard time making our lists because if we're not doing this in an organic environment, it's really hard to compile. What what would we complain about? Were we together?

Kelly (01:03)

Yes.

Yes!

Yeah, so I sat down with Scott and he helped me brainstorm a bit of a list because like, like you said, we have so many things we know we have so many things that we're like, this just grinds my gears or I refuse or whatever. For no reason. Sometimes there's a reason most of the time it's just like, I just feel this way. You can't, you can't convince me.

Nikki (01:43)

Mm-hmm.

Yep. And the thing is, is if someone told me, well, that's not right because of whatever, I don't care. It doesn't matter to me. Right? I feel how I feel, and maybe I feel good feeling that way. And that's fine.

Kelly (01:55)

No. Did I ask?

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Like, whatever, guess, like, negativity is like not good for you. I don't think this is negativity.

Nikki (02:14)

No. If you don't want to be negative right now, come back later when you're feeling a certain type of way about something.

Kelly (02:20)

Yeah. Yeah. We would love to know what you feel a certain type of way about because we got a lot of things we feel a certain type of way about. So.

Nikki (02:27)

Yeah.

And we're just, we're just doing very niche topics this time. Like, we're not even going to rant about all of the other things in life. We're just keeping it to, like art, essentially. Visual art. Performative art. Yeah. And, books.

Kelly (02:34)

Yes.

my god.

Yes. Yeah. Because if we, yeah, I guess, yeah. Slash books, storytelling, narrative, icks I don't know. and all related to that, hitherto, whatever. Because like, we could just sit here all day and just like live stream us complaining. Like we are the old, well, I'll say

Nikki (02:58)

Yeah.

Kelly (03:08)

We are the old men on the park bench in those TD commercials saying, no banks open on Sundays. Y'know, like, at least that's how I feel.

Nikki (03:18)

And I even kind of feel that way about the bank. So.

Kelly (03:21)

Right? Yes!

Nikki (03:24)

Who goes out Monday to Friday during work hours to bank? You're all working. Everybody's already at work.

Kelly (03:31)

right?

You're only making deposits for whatever business you work for. Nothing personal. Literally. Unless you have to book time off. I can't. I have to go to the bank. I can't. I have to do an errand for my personal life because I can't do it because I have to work to fund said personal life. Make it make sense. Like

Nikki (03:39)

Mm-mm.

I know. Unless you bang with TD, then they're open on Saturday.

Kelly (04:01)

I don't bank with TD Do you? What the fuck? Not sponsored. They just had a huge. I don't know. They just had a huge friggin fraud scandal in the States. Yeah. Suit. Yes. Yes. It's like billions of dollars. Yeah. Yeah. So maybe maybe not sponsor us.

Nikki (04:04)

I do.

But TD, should sponsor us.

Toronto Dominion Bank is in the States? That's weird to me.

Americans.

Only the Canadian side. Whoever wasn't involved in the fraud sponsor us. Or Scotiabank. I bank with you too. I love your scene points. Give me some more. Anyway, this isn't about banking.

Kelly (04:34)

Sure.

Yeah, I swear.

Nikki (04:46)

but just an example of some of the things we can get fired up about.

Kelly (04:50)

Yes, and like, honestly though, we blurb so many products and websites and things that we have no freaking like, we're not getting anything from it. I'm like, we are either the best advertisers or the worst.

Nikki (05:02)

No.

I think probably the latter because we're not getting anything for it.

Kelly (05:11)

That's how know you can trust us because we're not getting anything from it.

Nikki (05:15)

Nope. Zero things.

Kelly (05:19)

All that being said, okay, I feel like I'm just gonna dive in to one of my hottest of topics for myself, which pisses Scott off to no end whenever we have to pick a movie to watch, okay? I can't stand movies that take place within 24 hours. I can't stand it. I'm talking about, okay, so some popular examples are Ferris Bueller's Day Off, Hate It.

Nikki (05:23)

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Okay, I love it.

Kelly (05:49)

I fucking hate it so much. I can't stand Ferris, but the main reason is because I feel like when it's a movie and it takes place within one day, the pacing is so off for me. So I'm just like, I am bored. I am so over this. This day feels so freaking long. So Ferris Bueller's day off, the breakfast club.

I can't stand that movie. That's a whole other topic. Cause I never could relate to that movie.

Nikki (06:22)

I like that movie too.

Kelly (06:27)

But everyone around me is like I love that movie I'm like I hate it so much I hated well okay I didn't hate but Super Bad I've seen it all the way through once I don't need to see it again

Nikki (06:39)

Does it take place in one day? I've seen it so many times and I don't remember that.

Kelly (06:41)

Yes, it's so long. I feel I'm like 99 % sure it takes place in one day because they're like, we got to go to this party, right? So whether it's, I think it's like 24 hours, like from end of school day to the morning after or something, I don't know of that party, maybe. But like, I can't stand it. I like we'll go through movies of like, what do want to watch? I'm like, nope, takes place in one day. No, Groundhog's Day.

Nikki (06:52)

yeah.

Right.

Kelly (07:11)

that same day repeats over and over, I'm not gonna watch it.

Nikki (07:14)

That's what I was gonna say. I don't have a problem with movies that take place in one day, but I hate movies that repeat. Groundhog Day, Looper is like that too, but it's not like one day. It's like moments where he keeps going back. It's Joseph Gordon-Levitt. There was that one, Before I Fall, hated it. Hated it so much. Labor Day. Anyway, I...

Kelly (07:22)

Mmm.

I've never seen it.

Okay.

I fall.

Nikki (07:45)

hate those movies. I'm like, I didn't like it the first time you went through the day. I'm not gonna like the 20th time you go through the day.

Kelly (07:46)

Right?

Honestly, just make the right choice the first time. I'm kidding.

Nikki (07:57)

or accept the consequences of your own actions. I think in Before I Fall, she dies, but like, don't know. I can't really remember.

Kelly (08:00)

Yes!

Is this like a romance, like a sad romance or something? I have no clue.

Nikki (08:11)

She like sees somebody get hit by a car. No, I think that's it. She sees someone get hit by a car or something and then she keeps like reliving the day to see if she can like save this girl. And there's a party and she has a boyfriend and he's kind of shitty. Anyway, whatever. It doesn't matter because it's stupid. Yeah.

Kelly (08:29)

What? Ew. See, I hate that. There's so many movies I have never seen and never will because I hear in the synopsis, this crazy day. Nope. Don't care. Don't care. The only movies, cause I tried to think, are there any movies that are like 24 hours long, if you will, that I like? Speed, Keanu Reeves and Sandra Bullock. So intense. That's like high stakes action. Do you know Speed?

Nikki (08:41)

Nope.

Yep. I don't know Speed, but I know that they had a crush on each other when they were filming it and they didn't know. And so they could have potentially ended up together, but they didn't.

Kelly (09:10)

Okay, that's so tracks because you could, the chemistry is palpable. Okay. She's a bus driver. There's a bomb on the bus. And if the bus goes below 50 miles an hour, it's going to explode. And so he comes on the bus. He's like, you can't go slower than 50 miles an hour. And they're like trying to block traffic so she can keep driving. And she's like, I'm running out of gas and all these crazy things happen. That's intense. Yes. That warrants a shorter duration of plot. Okay.

Nikki (09:33)

Wow.

Yep.

Kelly (09:40)

Die Hard. Christmas Eve or whatever. Love Die Hard. 24 hours. Again, high stakes action thriller.

Nikki (09:44)

Mm-hmm.

Have you ever seen the show 24 where every episode takes place in 24 hours? Your nightmare.

Kelly (09:52)

Fuck no!

Nikki (10:01)

And it's always like a ticking like bomb kind of situation.

Kelly (10:07)

No, I have not. You know what? I'm not going to. That's hilarious, Nikki.

Nikki (10:16)

Your magnum opus, of hated.

Kelly (10:16)

I can't.

If someone needs to bring me down, that's what they'll do. They'll put me in a chair strapped to the chair watching things that are taking place in one day.

Nikki (10:24)

Yeah.

until you think your whole life is one day.

That could be like a really niche Saw movie. Like instead of getting physically tortured, you're getting emotionally tortured by media you hate.

Kelly (10:47)

and we're feeding them all the tools they need with this episode.

Nikki (10:54)

Don't tell them where we live.

Kelly (10:56)

Please! my god no. Okay, take it away Nikki, I have to get off this topic.

Nikki (11:01)

Okay.

I read The Wife Upstairs last year and I will never read another Frieda McFadden book ever again. I feel like while this might not be a hot take, it is a very polarizing one.

Kelly (11:13)

Yes.

Mm-hmm.

Nikki (11:23)

her books are trash. They're plagiarized from other books. And I kind of, I try really hard to be like, whatever people like to read, it's what they like to read. And as long as you're reading, that's great. Not this time.

Kelly (11:43)

Yeah.

Nikki (11:47)

People and this is like where I'm gonna like say a book snob opinion and nobody can tell me that like you don't have book snob opinions everybody does they just keep them in here but I'm gonna let mine out if you say that you are a thriller reader and you love Freida McFadden I judge you because if you really like to read thrillers you would find people who are better than her and realize that her books aren't very good

Kelly (11:56)

yeah. Yeah.

Nikki (12:16)

There you go.

Kelly (12:16)

I agree because okay, I feel like if you are just dipping your toe in and she's everywhere and you don't you have never read a thriller and you're like I've heard she's a thriller writer. I'm gonna read it great. And then you read something else. That's how I feel. I totally agree.

Nikki (12:32)

Yeah.

Yep, because I, yeah, really like I'm going to say it kind of in the same breath. If, yeah, if she's what gets you into reading the genre, it's a great genre. There are a lot of amazing authors and a lot of amazing plots out there. And if she's what gets you into it, so happy for you. But just when you get into the wide world of it, just stop, like hold her in your heart as a fond memory.

Kelly (12:52)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Nikki (13:08)

but not as the status quo of what a thriller book should be. Because if you read the books that she's taking the plots from, they're better than the ones she's writing.

Kelly (13:10)

No! No!

inspired by. Yeah.

like why would you continue to buy the massive tub of no-name ice cream for three dollars that tastes okay when you could buy a smaller tub for five dollars that tastes 10 times better

Nikki (13:41)

Yep. And really, to get even more into that, her books cost the same amount as books that are way better than hers. So just spend, spend $25 on a different book. Also, like, yeah, do a little bit of research on like, who's writing good books. If they have like, I was gonna say, if they have like 50 books out, maybe they're, they're probably really good. Not true. I take that back.

Kelly (13:43)

I don't know.

Yeah! So what is the excuse?

Yes! Or go to the library!

No, no, because that leads me to James Patterson. Is he on your list? Because he's on mine.

Nikki (14:11)

Ha ha!

yeah.

He is not on my list, but I've never read a book by him. My dad likes his books, I believe. Like, I think my mom's read some, but I've never read a James Patterson book. And I'm not really entirely sure what he writes. I don't even really know, like, what is his niche. Like, John Grisham writes law books. Does James Patterson have, like, a niche like that?

Kelly (14:24)

Mm-hmm.

Mmm.

Yeah.

Yeah.

You know, I don't think he does because I think he just tries to saturate as much of the market as he can. So from like a business standpoint, I'm like, good for you, dude, you're making money. He and Stephen King hate each other, which I think is hilarious and also like so immature.

Nikki (14:49)

Okay.

Mm-hmm.

yeah.

Well, I'm on Steve's side no matter what. So my boy Steve. Yep.

Kelly (15:09)

you're a grown ass man, you know what mean? Like, could you calm down and just like sell your books? But that's why I'm like, I think it's hilarious. But it's also like, please.

Nikki (15:20)

Do know why they hate each other?

Kelly (15:23)

I feel like I'll have to double check after like fact check myself, but I'm pretty sure Stephen King has said on record that he thinks James Patterson can't write. So he's just like, I don't like this. I don't like this guy.

Nikki (15:37)

Well, I mean, he said on record that Stephenie Meyer can't write, so... I mean, not that I'm disagreeing, but I still love Twilight. Like, totally separate issue. It really got us hooked.

Kelly (15:45)

Yes, that first book was great. That first book was great. It did. Yeah. So, you know, but okay, I have James Patterson on my list because I also have never read anything by him. But he has so many books out. And all the covers look so boring that I'm like, I don't want to read this. I wrote down

Nikki (16:01)

Mmm.

Kelly (16:09)

book covers look like something my friend's parents would have kept in the back of their car or in their bathroom magazine rack for when they need to read something to pass the time. That's what it gives me. And I'm like, you know what, I don't want to read that. Yes.

Nikki (16:23)

The poop book. Yeah.

Kelly (16:28)

And like friggin Dolly Parton! She released a book with him! You don't need James Patterson, you're Dolly Parton! Like... Right?

Nikki (16:30)

Yeah.

Yeah, that was weird to me. And I'm just like, why do you need to write a book, Dolly? Why can't you just stay in your lane? Yeah.

Kelly (16:41)

Or if you do, just do it. Don't wait. You don't need James. You're way bigger than James Patterson. Are you kidding me? I will always love you. Islands in the stream. Everything else she's done. Like, I don't know. So, but also he has like, you know how Rick Riordan has an imprint or whatever where it's like Rick Riordan presents this book. When, so when I worked at Chapters,

Nikki (16:48)

Yeah, that's pretty weird.

Yep. Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Kelly (17:10)

Those books go under the author's name. It doesn't go under Rick Riordan. James Patterson, it goes under James Patterson.

Mm-hmm. Yeah, I don't like it.

Nikki (17:22)

That's shitty. That's just like taking from people that you think their work is good, where like Rick Riordan's highlighting people and like giving them an opportunity. I feel like, at least that's how I feel. He has a very large name and if somebody writes a book that he feels is good for middle grade, he can help promote them so that they can succeed on their own. I think that's the point.

Kelly (17:28)

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah!

Yeah.

Yeah.

Nikki (17:52)

But that's shitty of James.

Kelly (17:55)

Right? That's how it comes off. Because maybe like, sure, maybe he is using his name to get more eyes on this lesser known person's work. But at the end of the day, if people don't know that it's by them still, because their name is smaller on the book than James, it is. I also want to know, like, what is the monetary breakdown here? Because they should be getting more money than he is, because it's their book.

Nikki (18:04)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, they wrote the thing.

Kelly (18:25)

right? So it just comes across like you're saying just not great. And yeah, that's why I'm just like, yeah. So I don't know, we were always so annoyed whenever we had to like, put his books on the shelf because there's no friggin room. Why do we have so many of his books? Like

Nikki (18:29)

Yeah, that's icky.

because no one's buying them.

Watch me read a James Patterson book someday and be like, he's my favorite author. Like, I know I'm going to get fucking burned like that.

Kelly (18:55)

Well, I'll put on a huge coat and say hell must have frozen over bundle up. Okay. There's no way. There's no way. I swear.

Nikki (19:05)

Okay.

Kelly (19:09)

Lay it on me. I think I know what you're gonna say.

Nikki (19:12)

Do you? This is TV-centric.

Kelly (19:13)

Maybe.

Oh,no.

Nikki (19:19)

I have no interest, like below zero interest in watching the Rings of Power series because they are not like the Peter Jackson movies.

Kelly (19:29)

yes, okay.

Nikki (19:31)

I, to preface, if people haven't listened to our Lord of the Rings series, I know a bit about Lord of the Rings, okay? I'm not saying this as someone who like watched the cinematic cut of Peter Jackson's movies and was like, these are the best things ever. That's not what I'm saying.

Kelly (19:39)

Mm hmm.

Yeah, and didn't even know that Aragorn actually broke his toe when he kicked that helmet.

Nikki (19:59)

It's important. At least.

Kelly (20:00)

It is, yes! Thank you. Thank you for telling me.

Nikki (20:03)

or that the significance of Galadriel giving Gimli her hair is because Feynor asked her to give her hair for the Silmerals and she was like, no fucking way. And then she gave it to a dwarf. That's so cool. Anyway, all of that to say, I know what I'm talking about a little bit, but Peter Jackson just did it better. Did he represent the characters the way that they probably should have been represented from the books?

Kelly (20:22)

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Nikki (20:31)

No, specifically the elves. They're like, they're so scary people can't even look at them. And then they cast Cate Blanchett, who's beautiful and ethereal, but not, yeah, but not so scary, like so beautiful, scary that you can't look at them. You want to look at them. Yeah. Yeah. So yes, I understand that he also didn't do that.

Kelly (20:36)

Mmm.

and Orlando Bloom.

just so beautiful you can't look at them because you're like, God.

Nikki (20:58)

But he did give the Balrog wings that were not used, which I appreciate because the Balrog can't fly and I will go to my deathbed saying that. That's something that's been argued on Reddit for so many years. And I am on the wings for looks train with that, not wings for function. Anyway. I watched the first episode of the Rings of Power. I was so underwhelmed. I can just read the stories.

Kelly (21:09)

Yes.

Mmm, yep. No.

Hmm.

Nikki (21:27)

and imagine what I want to imagine and you can't make me watch them. Boom. Yeah.

Kelly (21:34)

Good for you. It's like a lot to watch anyway. We watched, I think almost the whole first season. We didn't see the last two episodes and I have no desire to continue it. I really don't. Like it was fine. There were parts that I was like, this is intense. But there was also a lot where I was like, this background looks CGI. They look like they're in a sound stage with like three props and then a green screen. And you have a huge budget Amazon.

Nikki (21:42)

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Right.

Kelly (22:03)

What is this? Like, ugh.

Nikki (22:04)

Well, also when Peter Jackson, this is the thing, Peter Jackson made these movies in like the late 90s, early 2000s. And I mean, yeah, can you tell now when you watch on a large screen sometimes that things are like a little weird? Yeah, but for the most part, I don't notice. I can't tell when they're...

Kelly (22:15)

Mm-hmm.

Sure.

Yeah.

Nikki (22:32)

romping around New Zealand for real or they're on a soundstage for the most part. And that's saying that's like huge. That was 20 years ago, 20 plus years. And those movies have held up so well. And they're so iconic. And it could be the time in my life that they came out, but I don't think so. And there's. Yeah.

Kelly (22:35)

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

No, the practical effects, they won so many Academy Awards because it was well earned. Like it does hold up. It totally holds up. Like he is now synonymous with Lord of the Rings. You know what I mean?

Nikki (22:59)

Yep.

Yeah, and the people who are in the Rings of Power just look like they know what a cell phone is and that's weird. That's really weird. I don't want that from my elves.

Kelly (23:12)

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, that is so true. Honestly, like

Nikki (23:20)

or my hobbits or anybody like.

Kelly (23:26)

so true. You know what? On that vein, feel like maybe this is stupid to say, but sometimes I wish that these new projects, they wouldn't film with such high def cameras because it almost takes away from it sometimes because it's like, girl, I can see your makeup creasing and it's not your fault. I'm not saying fix that. It's like you're, I shouldn't be able to see every little thing because now I'm, I'm losing

Nikki (23:38)

Mmm.

Yeah.

Kelly (23:53)

the story in these real life details when I want to be whisked away, you know?

Nikki (23:56)

Right? Well, that's the thing, right? Like, some times things just aren't meant to be seen. And that's okay.

Kelly (24:08)

Yes. Yeah.

Nikki (24:12)

Not saying we have to go back to a square television, but like...

Kelly (24:17)

Yeah, rabbit ears. Yes. Yes. Oh my god. That's what makes like having the high def cameras is what's making me be like she's too old for this role or whatever because it's like I can literally see everything and it's not your fault. I'm not saying you look too old. No, it's like you can only pass for a certain amount of years.

Nikki (24:18)

We could leave some things for mystery.

Yeah.

Kelly (24:43)

or like a certain age range on screen. On stage, it's different, because you're not right up there, you know? So...

Nikki (24:46)

Right.

Once you're starting to get like, and everybody gets them, everybody gets crow's feet and stuff, but once you're starting to get that and they're zooming in on your face and you're like, I'm 21. I don't believe you.

Kelly (24:55)

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, there's nothing wrong with your crow's feet. It's just like, this is screen. It's seeing everything, you know? So yeah, because I felt like that was some lord of the rings. Yeah, yeah.

Nikki (25:07)

No!

Yeah. Yeah. If you want to be 30 playing a 12 year old, go to Broadway. They need you. They need you there for labor laws and stuff.

Kelly (25:22)

Yes! Oh my god! And sorry, I meant Rings of Power, not Lord of the Rings. Lord of the Rings is great. Rings of Power is what I felt like. Yeah. Yeah. Totally agree.

Nikki (25:29)

Yeah, yeah, I don't know. They're like, I mean, obviously I only watched the first episode so I cannot say. And maybe that's why this is a hot take because I literally shut it down 40 minutes in and I was like, that was enough for me.

Kelly (25:37)

Mm.

Yeah.

You know what? I feel the exact same way about House of the Dragon. I watched the first episode. I don't care to continue. I really don't.

Nikki (25:56)

felt that way too. I felt like Game of Thrones was so dark and gritty and I didn't read the books, but I really liked the show the first like six seasons. And watching the House of the Dragon, I was like this is so polished. Again, they look like they know what a cell phone is. I don't know how to describe that. Like they they look too modern. They looked like people from the 21st century who got dressed up.

Kelly (26:00)

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Yeah.

You know what? Part of it might be the makeup, the costuming, not like the clothes, like their makeup. Cause it's like, okay, we get it. You know how to contour. Yes, but like.

Nikki (26:23)

Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Modern. Yeah. But people weren't contouring back then. They just had fat faces and they dealt with it.

Kelly (26:33)

No! Yes! You think they're contouring in Middle Earth? Get out of here! They're not putting on a bronzer, like...

Nikki (26:39)

Yep.

And maybe, yeah, maybe the reason they didn't have that problem in Game of Thrones is because everyone was dirty all the time. Like everybody, yeah, everybody just looked fricking filthy and it was like, well, you don't need a contour when you have dirt, so.

Kelly (26:49)

They were all about to die any moment.

Yeah, literally or bruises on your face. When I got my wisdom teeth out, I had bruises here and it looked like natural contour for a second like green. It was like wicked contour.

Nikki (27:00)

Yeah. Yeah, but I agree.

Have any, have anything else you can take out of here to keep this going? It's like, how'd you lose all your teeth? Well.

Kelly (27:21)

Okay, like House of the Dragon. I know so many people who are like, it's so good. I'm like, I don't care. Because I also loved the vast majority of Game of Thrones until it like, was so stupid at the end when I was like, wow, what a waste of my time and my life. I felt so upset, but anyways, so betrayed. But like, the first episode of House of the Dragon, it was just like so violent and for no reason.

Nikki (27:33)

Mm-hmm.

Kelly (27:47)

that I was just like, I don't need to watch this. I already watched Game of Thrones. The excitement over this world is gone for me because the ending of the original series was so bad in my opinion that I'm just like, I don't care. Like you can't convince me to watch this show. There's too many shows on and I only have X amount of hours in a day. Like it's not for me. Thank you.

Nikki (28:10)

Yeah, I agree. I totally agree.

What's your next hot take?

Kelly (28:17)

Okay, well, this is one that I know we both agree on. Like we talked about it briefly together before. Sally Rooney. I don't know anything about her books other than she's very popular. know. Well, that- well quotation marks. I don't know if we can say all punctuation. Who fucking knows? I don't care. The fact that she doesn't use quotation marks. I don't care. Do you know why I don't care, Nikki?

Nikki (28:27)

Nothing. And she doesn't use punctuation.

Holy!

Kelly (28:44)

Cause I'm gonna, okay. So I don't care because the fact that everyone or everyone I've heard so many people say she doesn't use quotation marks. my God. And her stories are so great. It's Art with a capital A. Why do you need this gimmick to get your story noticed? Just use the fucking quotation marks. Who cares? It doesn't impact the actual story you're telling.

Nikki (28:46)

Ha!

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

I know.

Yeah, I agree. Like the... I do feel like it's gimmicky and the fact that she does it, it's almost like her saying I'm better than grammar. And that gives me the ick. That gives me the actual ick.

Kelly (29:22)

Yeah, I'm incensed.

Yes, I'm so much better. Yes!

Yes. And I don't know anything about her. I don't know anything about her as a person. She's probably a lovely person. I don't know. I don't know her. But I don't want to read her books. And so many people are like, oh my God, this book's amazing. She just had a book come out Intermezzo. The cover looks great. I love the chessboard cover. It looks so cool. I don't want to read it.

Nikki (29:38)

I don't know.

Yeah. One of my teachers and I were bonding briefly over books and she loves Neil Gaiman and I was like, oh my God. And I was like, who else do you read? She goes, I really love Sally Rooney. And I was like, yeah. And then I'm just smiling politely and she's saying, she has a new book coming out and I'm really excited. And I'm thinking, mm That's great.

Kelly (30:04)

I don't wanna read it.

Yeah.

Nikki (30:32)

trying to still sound... yeah.

Kelly (30:32)

You just feel the energy drop. You're like, huh?

I totally agree. Like I just I feel like someone would have to give me one of her stories reformatted with quotation marks, new cover, pen name. So I didn't even know it was her. And that's the only way I could give her an honest try because the fact that she doesn't use quotation marks makes me so mad that I just I don't want to read it. And I'm sure. Yes, I'm sure people are going to hear this or see this and be like,

Nikki (31:01)

It would be a hate read.

Kelly (31:08)

Well, Kelly, it's just a quotation mark. Like, who cares? I care. This is the problem. I care way too much. And I can't do it. I, one of my favorite nonfiction books that I've ever read in my whole life is Eats, Shoots and Leaves by Lynn Trouse or Truss. I can't believe I'm going to get her name wrong. I will make sure I correct it. it's on my shelf over there. I can't reach it from here though. But it is all about punctuation.

And you would think it would be so boring. It is actually one of my favorite books ever. And this would incense her, I feel like, or she would probably find it interesting and be like, what an interesting debate. Cause people like me are getting so ticked off and people like you getting so ticked off when it doesn't really matter. But if it doesn't really matter, why can't you just put them in?

Nikki (31:42)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Yep. Yeah, I just don't understand what the commentary is, I guess. What is the purpose for not using them? Do you just not like using them? Because that's not very interesting. What is the actual purpose behind you choosing to take the stance? Maybe she's talked about it. I don't know. I'm also probably not going to find out because I'm not going to seek her out.

Kelly (32:04)

Yes.

Mm-hmm.

No.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. I don't know.

Right?

Nikki (32:29)

I don't feel strongly enough about this that I need clarification. I just feel strongly enough about it that I'm not going to read her books. There's a, there are millions of other books in the world I can read that have quotation marks.

Kelly (32:36)

Yeah.

Yeah. Yes, and she's got millions of readers. So like, she's not hurting from us two. You know what mean? She's laughing all the way to the bank without quotation marks. How would I know she's laughing? I would just know innately because human beings know. Yes, I get it. I still want the quotation marks. Read Eats, Shoots and Leaves, people.

Nikki (32:44)

Yeah. So it doesn't matter. Yeah.

Ha ha ha.

Kelly (33:04)

She laughed. She laughed. Yeah, you're gonna go down.

Your narrator ick. Yes.

Nikki (33:13)

Ugh, that is an ick. I didn't even write that down, but I've talked about it in a lot of episodes, so I'll bring it up again. Narrators who talk with a flat tone when they're not saying dialogue drives me crazy. If I wanted a robot to read it to me, I could do that. I could literally do that. But I want personality.

Kelly (33:20)

Yes. Yes.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Yeah. Hey, Nikki, she said to herself.

Nikki (33:44)

And I hate the nasally tone that they use when they do it.

Kelly (33:51)

Give us an example. I just tried to give an example.

Nikki (33:54)

Okay. Give me like, what's a good sentence somebody could say? So, people are out partying. Oh my god, that's so great. She laughed.

Kelly (34:05)

You

Nikki (34:10)

"I'm having such a great time," Sheila said to her friend.

Kelly (34:11)

She laughed.

Nikki (34:17)

Excuse me, just be like Sheila said to her friend as they walked down the street. Just flow, people. Give it some flow. We know that she's not saying it because you said, Sheila said, we don't need to go into, like, the fifth dimension of horror for this, like, interlude into the next piece of dialogue. I just don't get it.

Kelly (34:27)

Give it some zazz.

Yeah.

You know, when I was in theater school, we had so many classes where they focused on when you're saying a line or delivering a line to not trail off at the end of it, because as Canadians, we tend to trail off at the end. See, like we start talking and then we go down. So when we're delivering a line, a scene is supposed to be like, I don't know what you just said, I forget, but like, hey guys, that was so much fun, right? You got to keep.

Nikki (34:58)

Right.

Kelly (35:14)

the level instead of, guys, that was so much fun going down and losing the energy. It's like, Hey, that was so much fun. Sheila laughed, you know, keep it up.

Nikki (35:15)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, you're going, they're going down after the dialogue. I thought that the thing with Canadians is that we up talk. I just did it right now.

Kelly (35:30)

Yep.

We do, yeah, we do up talk, but when we're...

I guess it's just different when we're playing a role, right? Like we're delivering dramatic text and we trail down at the end instead of keeping the energy. So it's not even the inflection, it's the energy. Yeah. Yes.

Nikki (35:43)

Right.

Right.

Right.

Right. Yeah, I noticed that a lot with people. And it wasn't something I used to notice when I was younger, but after learning what uptalk is, I hear it a lot. You hear it every day from people, which is wild. Which is wild. Wild? Because it's like a question, right? That's the thing. You end every sentence with a bit of a question.

Kelly (36:07)

yeah. Which is wild, yeah. I know I do it. Yep.

Yes, yes, yes. I definitely do that a lot.

Nikki (36:22)

Yes? Can we do a whole episode just doing uptalk? That would be so annoying. That would be so annoying.

Kelly (36:32)

I'd be like, yeah, I'd be like, you know what I really don't like? I really hate when you go to buy a book in store and the cover feels all like grainy and like the texture, which is on my list. But yes, if I said everything like that.

Nikki (36:48)

Segueing. I love it.

It's so annoying.

Kelly (36:54)

But am I wrong? When you pick up a book and you feel the texture and it's disgusting, I'm not buying it. I'm not buying it. Sometimes I'm not even reading it.

Nikki (37:04)

I find that a lot of books are getting more like that though. Because the shiny is out. And now we're in matte land, which I don't hate. Like I like matte covers, but then they can lean into that texture. Yeah.

Kelly (37:09)

Yeah.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

It's whatever finish. Yeah. Cause like I, I don't know how you feel about deckled edges, like the paper, the pages that are like kind of look old fashioned. see I do. I like them. So that doesn't bother me, but that can happen a lot with that type of cover too. And I'm just like, why did you do this? I was on your side and then I picked you up and I don't want to bring you in my home.

Nikki (37:31)

I don't like them. Okay.

Right.

Right. I don't have a problem with deckled edges texturally. I just don't think they look very good. I would prefer if the book was just cut straight. But yeah, but I don't have a problem with the texture of them. Like they feel kind of soft, which I guess is nice. Yeah.

Kelly (37:53)

Mm. Mm.

Yeah, that's fair. Yeah.

Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Because if they weren't, they'd be like, hello, paper cuts everywhere. Saw the book. my God.

Nikki (38:12)

Yeah.

While you're watching 24 hour or the show 24 over and over again, you're also getting cut by deckled, edged paper.

Kelly (38:25)

No, no, there were a couple books at work when I worked at Chapters where I would like make a coworker put them away because I didn't want to touch it and vice versa. Yes, there was a coworker that would just be like, Kelly, can you put this away because I can't touch it? And I'm like, I'm here. We're very caring. We were very caring for each other. So.

Nikki (38:34)

really?

That's so funny.

Oh my god, I'm curious to know what you thought I was gonna say before I said the Lord of the Rings. okay.

Kelly (38:51)

Sally Rooney. I thought you were going to say Sally Rooney. Because we were talking about authors and I was like, she's going to say it.

Nikki (38:56)

Mm-hmm.

This, my next hot take, is the last one I have, but it is book to TV.

Kelly (39:09)

okay. A two and one, a twofer, okay.

Nikki (39:09)

beef that I have.

So, I love Percy Jackson. I was extremely excited for the new series. I hate it. I hate it. I feel like they did not encapsulate the tone of the series at all. They changed things that were, in my opinion, unnecessary.

Kelly (39:18)

Mm-hmm.

Okay.

Mmm.

Nikki (39:41)

I'm not talking about Annabeth being Black. I don't care that Annabeth is Black. Even though he does talk about her eye color so much in the fucking book that you think they would have gave her contacts because he's like, her gray eyes, her gray eyes, her gray eyes. Yeah. Yeah. So anyway, I don't care that Annabeth is Black because I feel like that's where people's minds are going to. They changed unnecessary things. That's not it. She was like,

Kelly (39:45)

Yeah.

Mm. Right.

That's like Harry Potter. Like, why didn't they just give him contacts?

Okay, yeah.

Nikki (40:09)

she's a really cute kid and that's fine. I just feel like they made it really serious and there are a lot of super funny moments in these books and you can say that the Logan Lerman movies were bad because objectively they were but they had funny stuff in them that encapsulated the essence

Kelly (40:22)

Mm-hmm.

Mmm.

Nikki (40:37)

of what The Lightning Thief was like when you read it. And I'm just really not getting that from these books.

Kelly (40:40)

Yeah.

That's really interesting to hear from you because I've only read the first book so far and I only actually watched the first episode of the show. I have not watched any since and

Nikki (40:54)

Right.

Kelly (40:59)

maybe I was subconsciously picking up on this tone thing like you're talking about because you're right, it was not very funny, lighthearted adventure. It was certainly an adventure, but it was very like intense and his mom dies in the first episode. And I'm like, oh my God, like this is intense. This is not like, and of course it's going to be intense action scenes, whatever like

Nikki (41:10)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Kelly (41:26)

Yeah, there were there were moments like that in the book, but it didn't feel like a fun ride. It felt more like scary, but not scary. But yeah, serious.

Nikki (41:35)

It felt like they were confused about who their audience was. Like, their audience... are they shooting for kids now? Or are they shooting for people our age who were kids when the books originally came out? Like the OG fans. Are you making a darker, more mature version of this for adults to enjoy because they loved this world?

Kelly (41:40)

Mm-hmm.

Mmm.

Mm-hmm.

Nikki (42:04)

Or are you catering to 12 year olds that currently love the world? Because I feel like they were trying to balance both and it just wasn't really working.

Kelly (42:09)

Yeah.

No, I agree with that because yeah, it's like, I don't know, I, I feel like sometimes when it comes to kids content, like whether it's like, just because we come from theater, like whether it's like a play or a TV show or a book, whatever, a lot of times people dumb it down because it's for kids, right? And I don't think making this lighthearted fun in terms of tone would be dumbing it down. It's like, that's literally the tone of the book.

Nikki (42:41)

No.

Kelly (42:44)

It's magical. He's a half-blood Greek descendant thing, you know? Like, it's magical, mystical, it's action-packed, it's a hero story. Like, you know, it's fun. It's myth. It's not gritty. Like, they're trying to... Yeah.

Nikki (42:50)

Yeah.

Yeah.

I know. Yeah, I just, wanted the laughs. I'm currently reading The Lost Heroes, which is a sequel series to the Percy Jackson series. And this is my first time reading them. I didn't read them when I was younger. I don't have any like memories, like nostalgic memories connected with this. And I'm still laughing a lot.

Kelly (43:07)

Mm-hmm.

Nikki (43:28)

And I'm not laughing because I laughed when I was 12 and I remember how funny that was. I'm laughing because it's genuinely funny. In the second book, Percy is running away from these Gorgons and they have name tags on and he has dyslexia. And so, one of them is there. Her name's like Steno and he keeps saying Beano. He's like, and Beano over here has this food tray and I'm laughing so hard.

Kelly (43:49)

Okay.

Nikki (43:58)

And those moments were not in the series at all. I'm like, I want that Percy that we love. So it's a bummer, but what can you do? I do like think I probably will try to watch it again at some point, but I'm like, maybe when I've accepted that it's not going to be the same and I can

Kelly (44:05)

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Mmm.

Nikki (44:26)

try to enjoy it for what it is. But right now I'm not at that point.

Kelly (44:28)

Yeah. Yeah. Well, let me know what you think. Because like I said, I've only watched the one and I got Disney Plus again to watch it.

Nikki (44:34)

Yeah.

yeah.

Kelly (44:40)

But I mean, now I've been watching like Secret Lives of Mormon Wives and stuff. So I ended up keeping it, but I was like, I'm only getting it so I can watch this and I'll cancel it. And I haven't canceled it. Story of my life. Right. Story of my life. Okay. I have one. I have two. Well, I have many, but I have two that I definitely want to talk about because I feel like we can talk about it. Number one, romance books written by men. I have no interest.

Nikki (44:45)

Yeah.

Yep. That's always how goes with those.

Yeah. Yep.

Me either.

Kelly (45:10)

I have no interest and I don't care if that makes me sound like a bitch because I will say it for the world to hear. I have no interest. If you want to write this book for women, a romance book, I feel like the only way I'm going to read it is and maybe I should preface a romance book that's like catered to straight people. So like a man and a woman are the couple. That's what I'm saying. Not LGBTQ romance because

Nikki (45:38)

Yeah, that's a whole different, yeah.

Kelly (45:39)

That's different. Yes. If we're talking like white, cis, hetero, stereotypical romance books, okay? If you're a man writing this book, the only way I'm going to read it is if you have a pen name that is feminine. Because

Nikki (45:45)

Mm-hmm.

Ruby Dixon. I'm convinced. Yeah.

Kelly (45:57)

Like we don't know. Yeah, we have no clue, but I just, I can't, I have no interest in reading a book written by a man. I'm picturing James Patterson here writing this romance and I'm like, ew.

Nikki (46:07)

Yep.

you ever seen those TikToks of those girls reading romance novels written by men? And it's like, her breasts looked at me with desire and it's like breasts can't do that, first of all, and like, yeah.

Kelly (46:15)

Mm-hmm.

you

Her breasts were heavy with desire like two cantaloupes like ew what the fuck

Nikki (46:29)

Yeah. Like, no, they're probably just big and she's probably thinking about how much her back fucking hurts from how big her boobs are. So don't flatter yourself.

Kelly (46:31)

That's not...

Yes! Yes! No!

Nikki (46:42)

Uhhh... Men.

Kelly (46:43)

It's true! It's true! Like... So that was one of my big ones that I had to like big icks that I'm just like...

Nikki (46:52)

Yeah, like the way that they describe things is just so, so gross.

Kelly (47:00)

You know what? I read, I feel like I told you this ages ago. I, way back when the movie was coming out, I tried to read the book Red Sparrow. That was that Jennifer Lawrence, like, spy movie. And I'm all for a badass lady kicking ass, taking names, as you know, okay? I freaking love that stuff. So I was like, I want to read this book. I'm gonna give it a go. It's a spy thriller. She's an assassin. Let's go.

Nikki (47:10)

Okay.

Yep. Yep.

Yeah.

Kelly (47:29)

Every single man that she came across in the book immediately wanted to have sex with her. And I was like, okay, I get, I get you're a spy and that you were like trained in seduction, but I'm talking even her coworkers, literally every man she even shared air with is like thinking these lewd thoughts about her and all this stuff. And I'm like, this is disgusting. Like this sounds like the author

Nikki (47:37)

magic powers.

Right.

Kelly (47:58)

is really wanting something that he's not getting. And I feel like I'm like intruding on a private matter that I shouldn't be here for. You know what I mean? Like, it's just uncomfortable. It's really uncomfortable. So yeah, I didn't finish that book. I was really disappointed, especially since I forget the author, because I didn't like the book. And yeah, but I think the blurb said that he used to work for the CIA or something. So like some of this stuff is like,

Nikki (48:04)

Yep.

Yeah, I don't like that.

Kelly (48:27)

real, right? Or like inspired by truth and like, you know, sketchy spy stuff. And I'm like, I don't have any interest in reading this anymore because everyone is misogynist and it's disgusting. So disgusting. I can't stand it. I can't. Right?

Nikki (48:39)

Yep. Disgusting.

Yeah, I definitely understand that. And I agree. I'm trying to think, I mean, I'm reading a Rick Riordan book right now, but I don't read, I feel like a lot of books by men anymore. And it's not a conscious decision. But even like, I mean, I've been reading a lot of like thriller stuff and the majority of them are women.

Kelly (48:53)

Mm-hmm.

Same. Same.

No.

Yeah. And I wonder if that's more of like a kind of like a societal directive, if you will, because like more women read than men, and more women read fiction than men read fiction. So maybe more of the male authors gravitate towards nonfiction works. I don't know. But I think there's there's definitely some kind of correlation because like

Nikki (49:25)

Right.

Right.

I don't know.

Kelly (49:41)

Like it's no secret that more women read fiction than men. Like you can look that up easily. It's like clear as day. So, you know, for whatever reason, because we love men who read, we are all for readers, you know, if I see someone, I was waiting to vote the other day and a girl walked in and she had a book and I creeped on her so hard to see what book she was reading. I did all the tricks in the book. I did the

Nikki (49:46)

Right. Yeah.

yeah.

Kelly (50:10)

I'm bored. just looking. You know, like I was like, see what books she was reading. I did see. No, because I don't want to be that person. Hi, what are you reading? Someone you don't know.

Nikki (50:13)

Yep.

You should have just asked.

I am. I do it all the time.

Kelly (50:27)

I can't, I can't, I'm too nervous. But I did run into someone we know, we both know, I'll tell you after, in a cafe, a local cafe, and I was like, what you reading? Because I knew who it was and they were like, hi, you know, but.

Nikki (50:39)

Yeah.

Kelly (50:43)

I felt so awkward and bad because like if I'm reading in public I'm like don't talk to me please

Nikki (50:47)

Right? No, I'm like, please, please ask me if it's a book I like. I'm like, please ask me about the book so I can tell you that you should read it.

Hahaha.

Kelly (50:59)

I'm gonna like plan a meet-cute for us. You're gonna be reading, I'll be like, what you reading? Can you tell me?

Nikki (51:06)

And we can look like total strangers and everybody will be like super weirded out when I'm like, please sit down. Let me tell you about this book. The Book of Mormon.

That'd be a weird plot twist.

Kelly (51:23)

Right? Oh my God. Okay, I...

Nikki (51:26)

What you readin'? The Bible.

Kelly (51:30)

It's like that meme "what's your favorite book?" The bible the bible, the bible, the bible, like

Nikki (51:36)

Ew.

Kelly (51:37)

Which like, whatever, you do you. I have not read the Bible. I know very little stories, very few stories. All my biblical stories I know are from musicals or movie musicals. Pretty much. Sister Act, Joseph and the Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat, Jesus Christ Superstar, which I was confused about at times.

Nikki (51:48)

But yeah, that checks out.

Yep.

Yeah, I think after we saw that you were like, could you explain a few things to me?

Kelly (52:05)

Because like I know that story, but in that context, I was like, what? Cause they have to cut things out, right? To make it flow. And so when I saw it live the first time they had like a New York stock exchange ticker going around like day one or day two. And I was like, what? Like what does it

Nikki (52:11)

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah.

Kelly (52:27)

So whatever tells you a lot about my upbringing. Protestant I was like, I don't know what this is. But okay, this is not related, but I feel like I need to bring it up. Okay. I need to know, is there anything you see on a book cover that when you see it, you're like, I don't want to read that book or like, I highly doubt I'm gonna read that book and I'm talking like the actual design of the cover.

Nikki (52:34)

Ahhhh.

Photographs, like if it's a photograph of real things.

Kelly (53:01)

like a real person.

Nikki (53:04)

Yeah, or like real objects.

I want it. I really don't like books that don't have illustrative covers.

Kelly (53:16)

Hmm. Okay. Interesting.

Nikki (53:18)

Like I'm trying to... this is a book I really loved when I was younger, but I never would have picked it up now.

Kelly (53:25)

Okay.

Nikki (53:29)

Spanking Shakespeare. So it has like a guy on the cover. It's like a photo of a guy leaning against a wall for people who are listening and not watching. I hate stuff like this. If it was an illustration of a guy leaning up against a wall, I'd be like, okay, whatever.

Kelly (53:36)

Yeah.

I think I read that book when I was a teen.

Nikki (53:47)

It was so freaking funny. So funny.

Kelly (53:50)

Right? Yeah! But I know that type, that style of cover is so like early 2000s.

Nikki (53:59)

Yeah, this too. What are they called? To all the boys I loved before, all the Jenny Han books have like a photograph of a girl. I hate it. I hate it.

Kelly (54:02)

Hmm.

have no clue.

Mmm.

Yeah.

You know what I was going to say? I hate this is like, I don't know. I feel like it's just trending right now and I'm ready for the trend to move on. I hate seeing skulls on book covers. Cause they normally, they normally look so bad. Like it's like they picked the worst royalty free image and didn't do anything to it. And I think I have one right here. One sec.

Nikki (54:30)

Mm.

yeah, that is trending.

Kelly (54:49)

This has nothing to do with the story inside. Okay. I want to preface that because I like this author a lot. I hate this cover. I have not read it yet. I think because of the cover. This has a small skull right there. I just find the cover not really great, but for people not watching, it is the Foxglove King by Hannah Whitten. I love this author.

Nikki (55:06)

Mm-hmm.

Kelly (55:17)

I want to read this book. This cover is making me cringe with that skull there.

Nikki (55:23)

The cover looks like AI or like they clip arted stuff and stuck it together.

Kelly (55:33)

Stuck it together not well because I'm sure a lot of designers do that, but it's how you do it. You know what mean?

Nikki (55:41)

I just don't understand too after she did the...

the wolf and the princess girl. Yeah, that was a beautiful cover. It was like watercolor painting kind of vibe. So beautiful. And to go from that, where there was clearly a budget put into it, to that which looks like it's supposed to be a special edition. It has like sprayed edges, I think.

Kelly (55:49)

For the wolf. Yeah. Yes. So nice. Like folk art.

That's the Fairy Loot edition, but it's pretty much the same as the real one. Yeah. Yeah, there's a book coming out. There's a book coming out right now that I'm going to have you Google the image because this is what I'm thinking when I think of skull books, because there's so many that look like this. It's called Phantasma. P-H. I don't know the author. It's coming out or just came out at the time of this recording. It's like a dark romance.

Nikki (56:12)

Okay. Yeah. So... What the hell?

Okay.

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Yep, it's by Kaylie Smith. That's what it looks like for people watching. This is the quintessential Kindle Unlimited cover. Kindle Unlimited covers are Skulls Galore and Flowers, Skulls and Flowers.

Kelly (56:40)

fantasy, whatever.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yes!

Yes, look up Nikki St. Crowe. Nikki St. Crowe, the first book, that's the one I think of that I actually like the cover of, because it's a stylized skull.

Nikki (57:07)

I do like the covers for the Lost Boys series or whatever it's called. I don't think it's called the Lost Boys series, but people know what I mean, if they're familiar with it.

Kelly (57:13)

Yes. Yeah. Because yeah. Yes. Because again, I don't know Kaylie Smith. I don't know the book Phantasma. It could be great. I'm not saying anything against the book. I'm saying the cover itself. I look at and I'm like, but Nikki St. Crowe that book cover I love because it's a stylized skull. It looks spooky. It's different. It's not like we took a skull from

Nikki (57:27)

Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

Kelly (57:42)

Pixabay or whatever the heck and just yeah, you know and no shade against Canva. I love Canva.

Nikki (57:44)

Yeah. Canva. Well, I think that's the thing. When you read the books and you look at the skull on the front, they're all different skulls for each of the four books and they correlate like to, I don't even know what their names are anymore. I like finished reading things and it just totally goes out of my mind. The dark one who's Peter's like right-hand guy.

Kelly (57:59)

Mm-hmm.

to the people.

Yeah, yeah.

Nikki (58:14)

and one of his eyes is black and so the skull has that kind of hole that's mimicking what his face looks like. So you know the book is primarily focused on him. Now I want to read them again. They're so good. They're so bad, so good.

Kelly (58:19)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

I think another one came out. Another one came out this year and I missed it.

Nikki (58:34)

Is it part of this series? I think it's like a sequel series or something.

Kelly (58:38)

Yes. Well, it's the Tink stuff.

Nikki (58:42)

Yeah. Anyway, but I love them. I didn't.

Kelly (58:44)

Yeah. Sorry if you heard Lily grumble so loud. Well, someone might hear it. I don't know. We'll see. Sorry, my dog is cute and has thoughts also. Okay.

Nikki (58:53)

What a cutie.

She also loves Peter Pan retellings.

Ha

Kelly (59:06)

Okay, I think to finish this off, I would love if we could both just say first thing that comes to mind of a classic book or author that you have no interest in, preconceived notion, no interest, go.

Nikki (59:27)

Charles Dickens.

Kelly (59:29)

that's a good one. That's a good one.

Nikki (59:33)

I'll never, I will never. Couldn't pay me.

Kelly (59:35)

Virginia Woolf. Virginia Woolf.

Nikki (59:38)

Yep. Okay.

Kelly (59:40)

No interest, no interest. I have read one Charles Dickens for school. Hated it half first half, loved the second half, tried to read another book, couldn't do it. Couldn't do it. Virginia Woolf, I saw the movie The Hours when I was a kid. So depressing, because it's about her life. And I'm just like, I don't want to read her books and be in her mind, because what a dark place.

Nikki (59:46)

you

Yep.

I do feel like I want to read The Bell Jar. Do I feel like I will read The Bell Jar? I don't know. Like, probably not, but it is something that I feel that I want to aspire to do. But it's not a make it or break it for me. I did really like the play Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf? That was great. Not about Virginia Woolf, but...

Kelly (1:00:13)

Mmm.

No.

Sure. Different. Yeah. No. Yeah.

Nikki (1:00:38)

I actually don't even know why it's called that, but it was a really great play. Weird familial drama.

Kelly (1:00:44)

you know what? Yeah, I feel like Virginia Woolf for me, I would only want what I want out of her is I want to go to something like a wedding, let's say I get stuck sitting next to someone I don't know. We're drinking. I've had three glasses of wine they've had who knows how many and they start talking to me saying what do you- do you like to read? Yeah, I like to read what do you like to read? I like Virginia Woolf. Oh you do? I've never read her. Then they can give me the low down on The Bell Jar and I'll go okay. Cool.

Nikki (1:01:11)

Yeah. Yep. You just want a Ted talk about Virginia Woolf.

Kelly (1:01:13)

Cool, I don't need to read it.

but I don't want to have to pay to go to a TED Talk. I'm not seeking it out. If someone brought it to me, I would receive it.

Nikki (1:01:20)

No, no, no, but right. Maybe YouTube will bring it to you someday. Maybe there'll be a Virginia Woolf expert on a Ted Talk someday and you can watch it on YouTube and then you could drink before you watch it and then it could be like you're at the wedding getting this conversation from this person you don't know.

Kelly (1:01:39)

But then if I seek it out on YouTube, I have sought it out. I don't, I'm not wasting my time.

Nikki (1:01:44)

I'll send it to you so that it's seeking you.

Kelly (1:01:50)

Thanks so much, Nikki. Always looking out for me.

Nikki (1:01:52)

Anything for you.

Kelly (1:01:56)

Do you have anything pressing you have to get off your chest in this episode?

Nikki (1:01:59)

I don't think so, but I feel like we should do this more because this was great.

Kelly (1:02:03)

Yes, right. I feel this this Festivus is for the rest of us. Okay. I feel lighter. feel I feel great. Maybe some people listening feel differently if we had things to say against some of their loves. But you know what everyone this is for fun. I'm not doing a disclaimer because I hate that this is a fun conversation. And maybe this is a disclaimer. I don't mean that as one. Yeah.

Nikki (1:02:08)

Yep, it is.

Yep. And if you don't agree with us, good for you. You have your own mind and your own opinions and you are totally welcome to have those.

Kelly (1:02:33)

Yes. Yes. And we would love to talk about this stuff. Keep it cute as Jess says, Jess Owens, keep it cute. Because we love a good old conversation. Keep it cute. Keep it cute and classy. So with all that being said, that's it for us today. If you want to keep up to date on all of our bookish antics, icks, preconceived notions, what have you.

Nikki (1:02:41)

Yeah.

Yep.

you

Kelly (1:03:03)

off air, can follow us on Instagram at BYO Book Podcast or on TikTok at bring your own book podcast. And remember, if you're a white, cis het man, I don't want to read your romance book unless you have a female pen name. So yeah, see you later. Bye.